Cart Before the Horse?

[ProdigalSun]

I know it is, and am so grateful for everyone here.

If the stock was not permanently attached, and the length wasnt so short, this would be simpler.

[ProdigalSun]

OP, it's real simple, if your lower arrives with a stock intact, present or otherwise your ffl can transfer it as "other" but the ATF considers it otherwise.

This is where I get confused. I read the green and think, Ok got it, I'll fill out other on the 4473. Then I read the red and I'm not sure.

[plant.one]

so call the BATFE on tuesday.

tell them you want to build that specific lower as a pistol and then down the road SBR it when you have the extra $. ask them if thats possible or if because of how the lower is configured when sold that makes that a non-option legally.
'

then you know for sure where you stand and how you have to go forward.

[ProdigalSun]

I will do that.

[rebel]

Make sure and post back the reply here.

[dellet]

Here's the problem as I see it, and it probably looks this way to others reading this thread. You're not trying to understand the laws and rules, you're trying to skirt them in a way that leaves a lot to interpretation.

You started the thread with I want to have an SBR and there is now six pages of confused possibilities of opinions from people that really don't even know what parts you are gathering. If you want an SBR, you will need a stamp. If you want a pistol the lower you want is pointless to buy.

The lower you have chosen The CMT PDW with integral stock is a potential problem to assemble as a pistol. This will only become clear when you know how it was designated by the manufacturer and shipped to the dealer. Nobody here can give you that answer, unless they have purchased one and because it is very new design, that is doubtful. That also includes the ATF, unless CMT asked them for a ruling before marketing the product.

Here is the paragraph that may get you in trouble, remember a receiver is considered a "firearm"

Nonetheless, if a handgun or other weapon with an overall length of less than 26 inches, or a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in length is assembled or otherwise produced from a weapon originally assembled or produced only as a rifle, such a weapon is a “weapon made from a rifle” as defined by 26 U.S.C. 5845(a)(4). Such a weapon would not be a “pistol” because the weapon was not originally designed, made, and intended to fire a projectile by one hand.

Here is the ruling in question in is entirety:
https://www.atf.gov/file/55526/download

My guess is that if you call/email CMT they will tell you how they are receiving/shipping the lowers and this will likely end all the speculation.

Many rulings from the ATF are based on intent. The lower in question was in no uncertain terms intended to be assembled into a rifle. Anything you get from ATF needs to be in writing. Remember an opinion that you receive from the ATF is no guarantee that what you are doing is legal. It is a great bargaining chip should you end up in court for a reduced/dropped charge.

If you contact ATF your questions and intentions need to be clear.

My own opinion is you should buy it wait for the stamp and then assemble it.

[rebel]

+1

[ProdigalSun]

Here's the problem as I see it, and it probably looks this way to others reading this thread. You're not trying to understand the laws and rules, you're trying to skirt them in a way that leaves a lot to interpretation.

You started the thread with I want to have an SBR and there is now six pages of confused possibilities of opinions from people that really don't even know what parts you are gathering. If you want an SBR, you will need a stamp. If you want a pistol the lower you want is pointless to buy.

The lower you have chosen The CMT PDW with integral stock is a potential problem to assemble as a pistol. This will only become clear when you know how it was designated by the manufacturer and shipped to the dealer. Nobody here can give you that answer, unless they have purchased one and because it is very new design, that is doubtful. That also includes the ATF, unless CMT asked them for a ruling before marketing the product.

Here is the paragraph that may get you in trouble, remember a receiver is considered a "firearm"

Nonetheless, if a handgun or other weapon with an overall length of less than 26 inches, or a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in length is assembled or otherwise produced from a weapon originally assembled or produced only as a rifle, such a weapon is a “weapon made from a rifle” as defined by 26 U.S.C. 5845(a)(4). Such a weapon would not be a “pistol” because the weapon was not originally designed, made, and intended to fire a projectile by one hand.

Here is the ruling in question in is entirety:
https://www.atf.gov/file/55526/download

My guess is that if you call/email CMT they will tell you how they are receiving/shipping the lowers and this will likely end all the speculation.

Many rulings from the ATF are based on intent. The lower in question was in no uncertain terms intended to be assembled into a rifle. Anything you get from ATF needs to be in writing. Remember an opinion that you receive from the ATF is no guarantee that what you are doing is legal. It is a great bargaining chip should you end up in court for a reduced/dropped charge.

If you contact ATF your questions and intentions need to be clear.

My own opinion is you should buy it wait for the stamp and then assemble it.

Thank you, and I'm sorry for being a Jackwagon earlier.

[bangbangping]

My own opinion is you should buy it wait for the stamp and then assemble it.

You know what they say about opinions: Everybody has one, and dellet's usually doesn't stink too bad.

[dellet]

Here's the problem as I see it, and it probably looks this way to others reading this thread. You're not trying to understand the laws and rules, you're trying to skirt them in a way that leaves a lot to interpretation.

You started the thread with I want to have an SBR and there is now six pages of confused possibilities of opinions from people that really don't even know what parts you are gathering. If you want an SBR, you will need a stamp. If you want a pistol the lower you want is pointless to buy.

The lower you have chosen The CMT PDW with integral stock is a potential problem to assemble as a pistol. This will only become clear when you know how it was designated by the manufacturer and shipped to the dealer. Nobody here can give you that answer, unless they have purchased one and because it is very new design, that is doubtful. That also includes the ATF, unless CMT asked them for a ruling before marketing the product.

Here is the paragraph that may get you in trouble, remember a receiver is considered a "firearm"

Nonetheless, if a handgun or other weapon with an overall length of less than 26 inches, or a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in length is assembled or otherwise produced from a weapon originally assembled or produced only as a rifle, such a weapon is a “weapon made from a rifle” as defined by 26 U.S.C. 5845(a)(4). Such a weapon would not be a “pistol” because the weapon was not originally designed, made, and intended to fire a projectile by one hand.

Here is the ruling in question in is entirety:
https://www.atf.gov/file/55526/download

My guess is that if you call/email CMT they will tell you how they are receiving/shipping the lowers and this will likely end all the speculation.

Many rulings from the ATF are based on intent. The lower in question was in no uncertain terms intended to be assembled into a rifle. Anything you get from ATF needs to be in writing. Remember an opinion that you receive from the ATF is no guarantee that what you are doing is legal. It is a great bargaining chip should you end up in court for a reduced/dropped charge.

If you contact ATF your questions and intentions need to be clear.

My own opinion is you should buy it wait for the stamp and then assemble it.

Thank you, and I'm sorry for being a Jackwagon earlier.

No apology needed, everyone needs an attitude check every once in a while.

NFA stuff is a big decision, because of the paper work involved and stamp cost, quite often it's a purchase for life. You're better off taking your time and getting exactly what you want.