I guess we all choose our battles, some just need to choose more wisely.

[danner]

No person shall be........deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law........ 5th Amendment to the US Constitution. No person and no govt can deprive ANYONE of their liberty without due process of law, period. That's one of the only rules that matter, right there. No one gets to create unconstitutional anti-liberty control freak laws to tell others how to live because that is depriving them of their liberty and as stated before passing a law is NOT due process. Don't like it? Tough beans. Go move to cuba where you get to be as tyrannical and as anti-liberty as you like.

[VENT625]

No person shall be........deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law........ 5th Amendment to the US Constitution. No person and no govt can deprive ANYONE of their liberty without due process of law, period. That's one of the only rules that matter, right there. No one gets to create unconstitutional anti-liberty control freak laws to tell others how to live because that is depriving them of their liberty and as stated before passing a law is NOT due process. Don't like it? Tough beans. Go move to cuba where you get to be as tyrannical and as anti-liberty as you like.

Well, that would be stupid of me to move to a communistic country when I have everything I need right here. Youre the one that sounds like he "doesnt like it" and should be the one moving. We'll find you a country where you can committ all the crimes you want, do all the drugs you want, and have all the guns. Let me know how long you live.

[Hardrockshot]

Vent,
That is my point. The liberals here control everything cradle to grave. We have some of the craziest laws in the nation. While NCIS work in 98% of the cases
And any time someone wants to trade a feminist political person let me know. I got three that are worthless and have hurt this country more than any foreign national.
Just my opinion!

[plant.one]

just because bad people can get guns from other bad people, doesnt mean we should make it easier for them to get them from good people.

while waiting periods (and quite a bit of the other gun control nonsense) are for the damned birds, i dont feel that having your background checked in a system akin to NICS to make sure you haven't violated a few very serious societal norms is a bad thing in any way shape or form when you're buying them from a dealer.

having dealt with handgun waiting periods in the hands of local gun boards and having to hire a lawyer to get them to do their job because of a personal prejudice is no new thing to me. i've already been on that road, thank you officer *censored* for convincing me to get my CPL.

thankfully our gun laws here have been becoming more 2A friendly for the last decade or so - including (but not limited to) doing away with handgun waiting periods, relaxing of NFA laws, fixing the airgun thing (just this month!) just to name some highlights. Hopefully that trend can continue.

but unfortunately until or society can rid itself of the bad people, i still feel that its necessary to have SOME Kind of filter in place - to at least make it more difficult for bad people to get guns - and allow those who ply their trade in our hobby the ability to know that they're dealing with law abiding citizens. because frankly speaking, i'm glad that walmart can tell a convicted wife beater or illegal alien 'no i'm sorry sir, i wont sell you this shotgun'.




my $0.02 usd.

[VENT625]

Vent,
That is my point. The liberals here control everything cradle to grave. We have some of the craziest laws in the nation. While NCIS work in 98% of the cases
And any time someone wants to trade a feminist political person let me know. I got three that are worthless and have hurt this country more than any foreign national.
Just my opinion!

You do have some of the craziest laws, much like Detroit, Chicago, and New York. And thats why you all have the highest crime rates. They should all be hung from the highest tree, especially that Yee douchebag who wrote most of Cali's gun laws, then gets busted for illegally importing firearms. I do believe that people should have the right to own guns. I also believe that people need to follow the rules of society to keep them. The second you violate someone else's right, that gun right is revoked. People are throwing around "due process' like they know what it means. Just use some fricken common sense, giving criminals and druggies guns is just a plain stupid idea.

[danner]

Well, that would be stupid of me to move to a communistic country when I have everything I need right here. Youre the one that sounds like he "doesnt like it" and should be the one moving. We'll find you a country where you can committ all the crimes you want, do all the drugs you want, and have all the guns. Let me know how long you live.

No, the way this country is currently being run is NOT how it is supposed to be run. Your argument is filled with absurdities, as if disagreeing with you HAS TO mean one is FOR violent crime, and that is simply ridiculous. That you need to resort to such argument is an illustration of just how weak your argument is not to mention the ignorance of your position. Your position happens to be the dominant one in this country, that of being against freedom and liberty, and that's exactly why we have a police state, but it is not the way this country is supposed to be. You can like the bed you made but I do NOT have to like it.

I've argued that the laws today's society made violates the US Constitution, which you're apparently just fine and dandy with, and you've argued.....that I want to do drugs and "committ" [sic] crimes because I disagree with you. Seems you don't have much of an argument. But that's typical of someone who likes to tell others what to do, because they said so.

[VENT625]

Well, that would be stupid of me to move to a communistic country when I have everything I need right here. Youre the one that sounds like he "doesnt like it" and should be the one moving. We'll find you a country where you can committ all the crimes you want, do all the drugs you want, and have all the guns. Let me know how long you live.

No, the way this country is currently being run is NOT how it is supposed to be run. Your argument is filled with absurdities, as if disagreeing with you HAS TO mean one is FOR violent crime, and that is simply ridiculous. That you need to resort to such argument is an illustration of just how weak your argument is not to mention the ignorance of your position. Your position happens to be the dominant one in this country, that of being against freedom and liberty, and that's exactly why we have a police state, but it is not the way this country is supposed to be. You can like the bed you made but I do NOT have to like it.

I've argued that the laws today's society made violates the US Constitution, which you're apparently just fine and dandy with, and you've argued.....that I want to do drugs and "committ" [sic] crimes because I disagree with you. Seems you don't have much of an argument. But that's typical of someone who likes to tell others what to do, because they said so.

Ha!! You think this is police state?? You have no clue.....when there's tanks driving down your street, we'll talk about police state. Keep throwing youre rhetoric out there, you make yourself sound more like an ass with each post. I'm not the one with the "argument" here as I have no issues with the laws that were set before me. I obey them, and have no problems. All the crack heads that get out jail, we'll give them guns, and let them live with you and your family for a while, and see how that works out. You can feed them, house them and help them shoot up, all while spewing youre "due process" crap. Good day sir.

P.S. "Good day sir" means that I'm done, dont bother responding. Next topic.

[danner]

Ha!! You think this is police state?? You have no clue.....when there's tanks driving down your street, we'll talk about police state.

Ah, one with a lack of capacity to see beyond the end of their own face. Do you think you own your house? Your car? You're ignorant if you believe you "own" anything. You are simply allowed to possess things by the govt. In a country where the govt monitors everything citizens do, where on a daily basis police toss flash bangs into baby cribs and blow the faces off a little babies and gun down old men reaching for a cane or gun down citizens shopping in a mall (and get away with it), where the law makers and law enforcers live by one set of rules and everyone else lives under another set of rules, yes, that is a free country worthy of envy.

Keep throwing youre rhetoric out there, you make yourself sound more like an ass with each post.

Rhetoric? Do you even know the definition? The irony is you're the one using rhetoric in an attempt to equate needing control freak laws which violate the US Constitution and the liberty of all otherwise it'll be anarchy. I quote the founding fathers and you make stuff up. Rhetoric indeed.

I'm not the one with the "argument" here as I have no issues with the laws that were set before me. I obey them, and have no problems.

Of course, that's because you're an obedient subject. The Founding Father's had some choice words for obedient drones. “If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen.”
― Samuel Adams

All the crack heads that get out jail, we'll give them guns, and let them live with you and your family for a while, and see how that works out. You can feed them, house them and help them shoot up, all while spewing youre "due process" crap. Good day sir.

Yes, because I believe in liberty and following the US Constitution, while you do NOT believe in liberty and certainly don't like the constitution can only mean I am for GIVING crackheads guns. Your rhetoric drips with irony, LOL. And I'm happy to see that you think the US Constitution is "crap". Due process-what crap. LOL, not a surprise to hear you're hostile to the constitution.

P.S. "Good day sir" means that I'm done, dont bother responding. Next topic.

I'll re-quote Samuel Adams in response to that as it also seems quite fitting. “If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen.”
― Samuel Adams

I shall close with another quote from Samuel Adams.

“t is the greatest absurdity to suppose it in the power of one, or of any number of men, at the entering into society to renounce their essential natural rights, or the means of preserving those rights, when the grand end of civil government, from the very nature of its institution, is for the support, protection, and defence of those very rights; the principal of which, as is before observed, are life, liberty, and property. If men, through fear, fraud, or mistake, should in terms renounce or give up an essential natural right, the eternal law of reason and the grand end of society would absolutely vacate such renunciation. The right of freedom being the gift of God Almighty, it is not in the power of man to alienate this gift and voluntarily become a slave.”
― Samuel Adams

[VENT625]

[quote="danner"]

Ha!! You think this is police state?? You have no clue.....when there's tanks driving down your street, we'll talk about police state.

Ah, one with a lack of capacity to see beyond the end of their own face. Do you think you own your house? Your car? You're ignorant if you believe you "own" anything. You are simply allowed to possess things by the govt. In a country where the govt monitors everything citizens do, where on a daily basis police toss flash bangs into baby cribs and blow the faces off a little babies and gun down old men reaching for a cane or gun down citizens shopping in a mall (and get away with it), where the law makers and law enforcers live by one set of rules and everyone else lives under another set of rules, yes, that is a free country worthy of envy.

This whole paragraph wreaks of bullshit. Show me one instance of a cop throwing a flash bang in a baby's crib or blowing off a baby;s face. Plain stupid that is.

Keep throwing youre rhetoric out there, you make yourself sound more like an ass with each post.

Rhetoric? Do you even know the definition? The irony is you're the one using rhetoric in an attempt to equate needing control freak laws which violate the US Constitution and the liberty of all otherwise it'll be anarchy. I quote the founding fathers and you make stuff up. Rhetoric indeed.

I'm not the one with the "argument" here as I have no issues with the laws that were set before me. I obey them, and have no problems.

Of course, that's because you're an obedient subject. The Founding Father's had some choice words for obedient drones. “If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen.”
― Samuel Adams

All the crack heads that get out jail, we'll give them guns, and let them live with you and your family for a while, and see how that works out. You can feed them, house them and help them shoot up, all while spewing youre "due process" crap. Good day sir.

Yes, because I believe in liberty and following the US Constitution, while you do NOT believe in liberty and certainly don't like the constitution can only mean I am for GIVING crackheads guns. Your rhetoric drips with irony, LOL.

P.S. "Good day sir" means that I'm done, dont bother responding. Next topic.

I'll re-quote Samuel Adams in response to that as it also seems quite fitting. “If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen.”
― Samuel Adams

I shall close with another quote from Samuel Adams.

“t is the greatest absurdity to suppose it in the power of one, or of any number of men, at the entering into society to renounce their essential natural rights, or the means of preserving those rights, when the grand end of civil government, from the very nature of its institution, is for the support, protection, and defence of those very rights; the principal of which, as is before observed, are life, liberty, and property. If men, through fear, fraud, or mistake, should in terms renounce or give up an essential natural right, the eternal law of reason and the grand end of society would absolutely vacate such renunciation. The right of freedom being the gift of God Almighty, it is not in the power of man to alienate this gift and voluntarily become a slave.”
― Samuel Adams[/quote]

Here is the definition of police state:

Police state is a term denoting government that exercises power arbitrarily through the police. Originally the term designated a state regulated by a civil administration, but since the beginning of the 20th century, the term has "taken on the emotional and derogatory meaning."[1]

The inhabitants of a police state may experience restrictions on their mobility, or on their freedom to express or communicate political or other views, which are subject to police monitoring or enforcement. Political control may be exerted by means of a secret police force which operates outside the boundaries normally imposed by a constitutional state.[2] Robert von Mohl, who first introduced the rule of law to German jurisprudence, contrasted the Rechtsstaat ("legal" or "constitutional" state) with the anti-aristocratic Polizeistaat ("police state").[3]


Let me know when youre not free to move about. Let me know when youre not allowed to express your politcal views. Let me know when the police are monitoring you. Ive worked in LE for over 20 years. Cops dont give a shit about you. You are a "no one". You make this shit up to make yourself feel like something because youre nothing. Never have been and never will. Keep thinking that people are following you. I love talking to people like you. As for I dont believe in liberty, I served in the Coast Guard for 4 years, risking my life as a rescue swimmer and 2 years in the Army Reserve in the NBC. Dont even go there, that I dont care about liberty. I gave 6 years of my life so numbnuts like you can spew your feces all over the net. Sit there behind the keyboard and type away, thats all you have. I own my house, I own my car, in fact two. You dont even own your mind....how sad. Have you served your country? I did, and your welcome.

[danner]

I thought you were moving on? You were moving on before you were moving on I guess? You were for it before you were against it, right?

Here is the definition of police state:

LOL, you had to look up the definition?

Police state is a term denoting government that exercises power arbitrarily through the police.

What exactly do you think laws which attempt to regulate morality are? Most of the laws on the books are arbitrary and usurped powers not authorized to the govt and exercised through police action. The evidence is all around you on the news every single day, but when one looks at things through the rose colored lens of an obedient subject everything looks rosy.

Let me know when youre not free to move about.

Tell that to the people in Baltimore. http://truthinmedia.com/baltimore-exclu ... d-account/

Let me know when youre not allowed to express your politcal views.

Tell that to the conservative groups the IRS targeted.

Let me know when the police are monitoring you.

Guess you've never heard of the patriot act or the NSA spying on you. Not sure what planet you've been on for the last few years but that's all common knowledge.

Ive worked in LE for over 20 years.

Whoopdie doo.

Cops dont give a shit about you.

Really? Tell me more.

You are a "no one". You make this shit up to make yourself feel like something because youre nothing.

Yeah, I'm the one using rhetoric. Pot, meet kettle.

Never have been and never will. Keep thinking that people are following you.

Where did I say I was being followed? You making stuff up again I see.

I love talking to people like you. As for I dont believe in liberty, I served in the Coast Guard for 4 years, risking my life as a rescue swimmer and 2 years in the Army Reserve in the NBC.

Serving in the military has nothing to do with believing in liberty. People serve for all manner of reasons. I knew some guys who were given a choice by a judge, to either go to jail or join the USMC. Very few have a clue what liberty is, and you certainly don't have a grasp of it as you associate liberty with control freak morality laws, and that's absurd, LOL.

Dont even go there, that I dont care about liberty.

I went there. Now what?

I gave 6 years of my life so numbnuts like you can spew your feces all over the net.

I served in the military too, 6 years active duty so I paid my own way. You don't get to hold diddly squat over my head, son.

Sit there behind the keyboard and type away, thats all you have. I own my house, I own my car, in fact two.

LOL!!! So you own a house? Wow! You own not just one car, but two cars. Double wow! Color me impressed! Now if you say you also own a color tv I don't think I could contain my excitement. I can only hope to one day live up to half of that impressive haul. ETA: if you really believe you "own" your house stop paying your property tax and soon enough you'll figure out exactly who it is that really "owns" your house. Same with your car, stop paying your registration, park it in your driveway with your expired tag facing the street and you'll find out soon enough who the real owner is.

You dont even own your mind....how sad. Have you served your country? I did, and your welcome.

Again, you don't get to hold anything over me, son. I paid my way and I paid my debts. You can stick your self-righteous attempt at a claim over me where the sun doesn't shine, sunshine. I would never NEVER attempt to hold my service to this country over someone else's head as I don't believe I have ANY claim on another. That's the difference between what I believe and what you believe. I wish I could say it is shocking, but that would be a lie. In fact that is exactly how it had to go down.