Lightweight Subsonic Loads over 4227 or Unique

[vetman]

Has anyone loaded any lightweight subsonics (110 and less) over 4227 or Unique? I will only be shooting these loads in bolt action rifles.

Do either one of these powders need a case filler?

[yondering]

If you're looking for minimum noise, Unique is much better than 4227. Better yet are even faster powders like Bullseye, Clays, or American Select. Of course there's Trail Boss as well.

Anyway, if you're going to use Unique, no, you don't have to use a filler, although depending on the load you may notice velocity changes from powder position sensitivity. IIRC I used it for with Hornady's 90gr XTP and 100gr SJ bullets but then switched to Bullseye for better results.

[threehundred]

Powder positioning is why I went to Trail Boss when I wanted to develope some 85 grain 223rem subs.

I started at 50% of case capacity BELOW BULLET BASE which resulted in a squib. With a properly sized wooden dowel it took only a moment to push out. I kept increasing the charge until it reached the IMR recommended starting charge of 30% less than case capacity BELOW BULLET BASE, with only 3 or 4 more squibs to push out.

These loads are very nice and quiet (TO ME) without a suppressor, through my Rem7615 pump 223/5.56. And, if memory serves me, this load is also a very low flash, night time, rat eliminator.

As I said, powder level was a main concern for me, and Trail Boss is as light and fluffy, a case filling powder, as I have ever used.

[hardcase]

By necessity, I have been using a lot of TB lately. Back when the powder shortage hit a few years ago, I bought a big jug just to have something to load. Now I am just trying to find a use for it. It shoots OK for subs, just doesn't meter that well.

[vetman]

The reason I am asking is anecdotally to my ear and others the Trail Boss is significantly louder. When I load Trail Boss with the 90 Grain XTP I always get a "pssst" when I fire the gun. I am running a Ruger American with different Silencerco Suppressors.

When I loaded the 90 Grain XTP over Unique it is so much more quiet running the same average velocities as the Trail Boss. I have not tried the 4227 with the 90 Grain XTP, but with 190 Grain bullets even 4227 is quieter than the Trail Boss. There is such a difference to me that I can tell the difference between a Trail Boss Load and a Unique Load just by sound if I get them mislabeled.

My concerns are accuracy, velocity spread and position sensitivity with both Unique and 4227. I have not run enough loads with either to determine those variables.

I also wonder if it would be a viable option to use a case filler in the Unique loads. My concern there is shooting the filler through a suppressor and any damage it may cause.

[yondering]

Try Bullseye or Clays. (Clays is my preference now). Either one will give you quieter loads than even Unique, with less position sensitivity. No need for fillers.

[cwlongshot]

Powder positioning is why I went to Trail Boss when I wanted to develope some 85 grain 223rem subs.

I started at 50% of case capacity BELOW BULLET BASE which resulted in a squib. With a properly sized wooden dowel it took only a moment to push out. I kept increasing the charge until it reached the IMR recommended starting charge of 30% less than case capacity BELOW BULLET BASE, with only 3 or 4 more squibs to push out.

These loads are very nice and quiet (TO ME) without a suppressor, through my Rem7615 pump 223/5.56. And, if memory serves me, this load is also a very low flash, night time, rat eliminator.

As I said, powder level was a main concern for me, and Trail Boss is as light and fluffy, a case filling powder, as I have ever used.

I STILL kick myself for passing on these guns....

CW

[Whole Bunches]

I shoot thousands of USGI M160 108gr frangible bullets in my Blackout bolt and single shot rifles.

I was using 3.9gr Unique, but switched to 3.3gr Bullseye due to more consistent velocity, easier to throw uniform charges out of a measure, and cleaner in my suppressor. Unique averaged 1052fps in my Handi Rifle and Bullseye averaged 1034fps. I also felt the Bullseye load was a smidge quieter suppressed. Unique would give an occasional supersonic shot. Unique would slowly buildup a gray residue in the 1st chamber of the suppressor (firing full power jacketed ammo would make it go away).

Tried a friend's load of 3.5gr AA#2 and got a nice 5 shot group, but I have plenty of Bullseye so I never went the AA#2 route.

[Cannonsville69]

Thread's a few years old but thank you to everyone that posted. This is exactly what I'm looking for. 80-125 grain subs 900-1000 Fps. (And other 300BLK reloading in general) I have trail boss, 4227, 1680 but no Unique.
I'm on a phone, it's late, I'll search further tomorrow. Hope to find more "light load" subs recipes. Thanks all !

[Cannonsville69]

...crickets ???

.....anyone ???