When will new (post 41F) Form 1 be published??

[DoubleJ]

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I'm thinking the fingerprints (and photos) it sounds like, are needed for each "Responsible Person", who can execute things on behalf of the trust. Don't think it's everyone named in the trust. So, guessing that's just going to be me, or me and wife at most. Not that she'd be ordering anything!...

Good idea going for the trust, some recent articles I've read indicate it's still the way to go. As for a benefeciery, I'd be more than happy to take on those goodies after you pass, just let me know.

The reading I've been doing also indicates that your statement above is going to be a grey area that will have to be hashed out since 41F just went into effect today. It's unclearly written, and will probably be challenged, but it would be nice if the trustor could deal with the fingerprints and photos, and the trustees were just there as shooting partners, or in case something bad happened. My mom is the only one on my trust right now, she's never handled an NFA item in her life, probably thinks they're illegal. Her main purpose as a trustee is if I should die prior to my 8 year old turning 21, she'll hold all the items until that time, and my kid can decide to keep em or sell em.

Let us know what's said in the sit down, very curious, I haven't talked to my lawyer in quite a while, so not sure what he thinks about it.

Here's a good read, answer some questions, asks some others.

http://www.nfafa.org/atf41p.cfm

[Alex Wilson]

There is an easy work around for getting everyone finger printed on a trust. Take them off the trust when you file. Put them back on after filing. This is exactly what my lawyer told me to do when I asked him about it. While I don't necessarily agree with it, no where in the law does it say you can't do it. It's a loophole in the law.

I bought 4 suppressors this year to I'm tryig an avoid messing with 41F. As of right now, I'm not filing any new paperwork. If something revolutionary comes out, that may change.

SilencerShop is developing an easy way to submit all the new info. They are shipping Kiosk to every state that will help you get finger printed and photo'd. I think that's a great business idea from them. According to thier website, they will be placed in a large city that is centrally located in the state. I think they are shipping the kiosk next month or in Sept.

[jrowland96]

Thanks for all of your thoughts on this... Very much appreciated!

Had my meeting and got my trust, and he was very helpful in all of his information. Unfortunately, he also said the new 41F has some "gray areas", and he couldn't say definitively how everything would function in reality. He said check back with him, as he'd be putting in some silencers through his own trust, just to see how the process works, and he can then pass that on to his clients.

I read an interview with an ATF agent from the NFA division (on TFB The Firearm Blog, I *think*), asking how trusts would work with 41F. Some really crappy things he said, so hopefully it changes.

Going from memory here, so not gospel (and who knows... if you ask 10 ATF agents the same question, seems likely to get 10 different answers).

According to this interview, fingerprints and photos (2x each) would need to be submitted for ALL Trustees for EVERY application. So if you have 11 Trustees, you need fingerprint cards and photos for ALL 11 for each item you put in?? LOL OMG... Seems like they should make the photos/fingerprints be on file for 2-5 years or something before new ones needed to be submitted. Guess wife and I will be on a first name basis with the fingerprint lady at the police station. haha I can see the PD getting pissed about that if enough people start coming through for fingerprints. Guess we tell them to "talk to the ATF" if they don't like it?

Also, he made it sound like a Form 1 or Form 4 would need to be submitted by EACH Trustee as well?? That makes no sense... Luckily just being me and my wife, but if you had multiple people on a Trust, for example, they ALL have to have a form 1 filled out, and fingerprints, and photos for each item purchased through the trust, EACH time? Good luck getting "Uncle Bob" to fill that out and get that to you so you can submit the forms... And have fun bringing in a giant box to hold all of the duplicate forms, fingerprints, photos, for each person on each submission...

Seems to me (hopefully) some reason might shake out of this eventually, and how I *thought* it would work. Fingerprints and photo cards, once initially submitted, should on file for each Trustee for a period of time. that would make too much sense though.

[trabikoenig]

Seems to me the thing to do would be to remove all my trustees from the trust in order to purchase a new item, then add them all back on when I receive the item.

As Alex Wilson said:

There is an easy work around for getting everyone finger printed on a trust. Take them off the trust when you file. Put them back on after filing. This is exactly what my lawyer told me to do when I asked him about it. While I don't necessarily agree with it, no where in the law does it say you can't do it. It's a loophole in the law.