Bolt action specific subsonic loads.

[Dolomite_Supafly]

Saving it for later.

[N2130N]

Tried the M62 tracers over 6.0 of trailboss. Slightly better ignition rate (around 65%) & subsonic but I had to seat the bullets waaay out not to compress the TB much.

Next lot is loaded over 5 grains of bullseye.

I'm running out of powders to try for subs. Pretty soon these might all get loaded into supers to assure a better ignition ratio.

The giggle factor is still off the scale...! our New years tradition of launching tracers at my friend's property was a hit again. I loaded up over a hundred 5.56 tracers for a friend's M4 which looked like freaking starwars during a mag dump & a handful for my quiet rifle. The pond was frozen this year & bouncing them off the ice had people exhausted from laughter. Through sceintific research (sarcasm) I found out how to get one to double bounce!

We've now made a game out of tracer-bouncing. I'm in the lead, but only by one double bounce. Can't seem to get one to bounce three times... more research is needed.

Will advise.

[Jupiter7]

Tried the M62 tracers over 6.0 of trailboss. Slightly better ignition rate (around 65%) & subsonic but I had to seat the bullets waaay out not to compress the TB much.

Next lot is loaded over 5 grains of bullseye.

I'm running out of powders to try for subs. Pretty soon these might all get loaded into supers to assure a better ignition ratio.

The giggle factor is still off the scale...! our New years tradition of launching tracers at my friend's property was a hit again. I loaded up over a hundred 5.56 tracers for a friend's M4 which looked like freaking starwars during a mag dump & a handful for my quiet rifle. The pond was frozen this year & bouncing them off the ice had people exhausted from laughter. Through sceintific research (sarcasm) I found out how to get one to double bounce!

We've now made a game out of tracer-bouncing. I'm in the lead, but only by one double bounce. Can't seem to get one to bounce three times... more research is needed.

Will advise.

I would start a tad lower on bullseye. 4grns and 160grn cast bullets gets about 1000fps from 16" barrel. 2.5 about 800fps(stupid quiet).

[N2130N]

Tried the M62 tracers over 6.0 of trailboss. Slightly better ignition rate (around 65%) & subsonic but I had to seat the bullets waaay out not to compress the TB much.

Next lot is loaded over 5 grains of bullseye.

I'm running out of powders to try for subs. Pretty soon these might all get loaded into supers to assure a better ignition ratio.

The giggle factor is still off the scale...! our New years tradition of launching tracers at my friend's property was a hit again. I loaded up over a hundred 5.56 tracers for a friend's M4 which looked like freaking starwars during a mag dump & a handful for my quiet rifle. The pond was frozen this year & bouncing them off the ice had people exhausted from laughter. Through sceintific research (sarcasm) I found out how to get one to double bounce!

We've now made a game out of tracer-bouncing. I'm in the lead, but only by one double bounce. Can't seem to get one to bounce three times... more research is needed.

Will advise.

I would start a tad lower on bullseye. 4grns and 160grn cast bullets gets about 1000fps from 16" barrel. 2.5 about 800fps(stupid quiet).

For a 168 Amax I use 4.6 grains for 1030 fps. I went with 5.0 even though the tracer is lower in weight, it has a loooong body (easily the same length of a regular 190gr) so I need to overcome the extra friction of the long bullet.

Also I ran across a fascinating article that correlated the pressure of a load to the ignition rate of tracers. Basically, the load has to produce X amount of pressure to ignite the tracer. The actual powder behind it makes no difference, only the pressure it creates. Thinking about my previous success with pulled M27 heads I have not-so-scientifically decided that they were so successful (100% ignition) because the 30 carbine is a lower pressure round. So unknowingly I easily made a subsonic tracer load since the heads I were using didn't need the pressure of a full power rifle tracer.

Now being out of M27s I believe I am faced with needing higher pressure to ignite the M62s. To raise pressure but not velocity you need to move to a faster powder.

I should be able to toss these bullseye loads in a few days. Got ice coming in right now so Wx is suitable for tracer testing.

[N2130N]

Got it! 5.0 grains bullseye behind an M62 tracer head lights 100% and is easily sub in cold Wx.

I only did a few so next batch will be at 5.2 grains to help insure ignition.

Yippie!

Oh & these things are scary quiet.... still amazes me how quiet these bullseye loads are!

[JDNC]

N2130N, This is the best informative thread I've seen in awhile! I don't post much but I do have a few questions you guys might help me with.

I, like others have formed some opinions over the years (over 60 in my case, and over 40 yrs hand loading). Some of that later maybe if in case anyone might be interested.

I have both AR and Ruger ranch in 300 blk using a Omega suppressor. I have a Dillon setup using A1680 for subs as I can use this load in both guns. Recently (as I also like to tinker) I was thinking about using a faster powder and lighter bullet, that's when I came across this thread.

Question, In reference to velocity spreads has anyone tested standard vs mag primers as I have not.
Question, Does the thinner jackets on some of the lighter rifle bullets (spr 125 TNT) expand at sub velocities?
Question, Does one powder appear to burn cleaner?

Opinions (or observations over the past 45 years) BTW, years doesn't mean anything but the fact I'm just old!

I've used and like the heavier bullets due to the fact the powder burns more efficiently and cleaner due to the mass of the bullet but would like to use lighter bullets in my bolt gun. IMO that we can not depend on burn rate charts too much due to the lower pressures (subsonic) that we are using. So we will have to just test, test, and test as we do. Also, I've found Quick Load very helpful with standard loads but just about useless with subsonic loads due the different powder burning characteristics at these lower pressures. It is very helpful comparing load density just not powder selection.


Every bullet I've shot subsonic in ballistic gel has failed to expand. I swage 30 cal bullets so I have several different length jackets to play with. I swage bullets ranging from 168-205grn both lead tip and open tip and they also failed to expand. All had great penetration. So, I machined a serration die to make six serrations down the jacket prior to swaging. These expanded but not like I would have liked. So I then made a die where I could cut a cross down about 1/8" on the core before seating and point forming. Now we're talking, these expanded completely in the first 7-8" upon entry in the gel block. But what a pita to swage.

IMO, one needs to depend on a wide meplat for terminal performance unless using a custom bullet. I don't subscribe to tumbling(keyholing)bullets not that they won't kill but because I want more accuracy down range.

Powder coated wide meplat cast has my interest now as I have a shop full of 30 cal molds. I just don't know enough about PC residue left in the suppressor.

Hope I haven't bored everyone. Just some questions, and observations over the years.

JD

[JDNC]

The only fast powders I have on hand are H universal, WST, and 2400. I tried universal today behind a 125 Speer but the velocities were jumping mid 900's to over 1100 with a 5.6gr charge. Sure wish I had some unique to try. I thought I might try some mag primers as I was using cci400 but I really don't think it will change much.

I think I'll go back to heavier bullets until I can locate some Trailboss. I would like to find a consistent light weight bullet load. The heavy bullets are expensive. I think I'm going to shoot some of the 125 Speer TNT's in ballistic gel to see if they'll expand at subsonic velocities though.

JD

[rebel]

They won't.

[JDNC]

They won't.

I think I'll take your word for it as I hate to drag all that crap out for a few shots! I think I'll try Universal powder again except seat the bullet deeper maybe I'll get better powder ignition.

Thanks

[rebel]

They won't.

I think I'll take your word for it as I hate to drag all that crap out for a few shots! I think I'll try Universal powder again except seat the bullet deeper maybe I'll get better powder ignition.

Thanks

Try a 90 gr XTP .310 diameter. Fun and will expand.