NFA TRUST

[randyrucker]

You could do it as a corporation or partnership also I believe. Here's an idea: Offer free suppressors to any Starbuck's corporate officer that submits a corporate Form 4. I like it.

[plant.one]

crowd source the funding for it and i'd donate

[weejub]

Excuse the daft question from the UK, but what is the purpose of having an NFA trust?

Because of US laws (the NFA in this case), there are 2 routes to ownership of suppressors and other items regulated by said act (such as short-barrelled rifles and shotguns...you guys in UK i believe dont have to worry about such things, because if i remember right, once you are licensed for a firearm, you can modify it however you choose other than making it fully automatic...)
the 2 choices are:
1) purchase in your own name (which requires your local chief law enforcement officer to sign, for you to submit fingerprint cards, and also for you to submit passport-like photos...
-OR-
2) form a trust to place the items in, which doesn't require any of the above.

An added bonus for some recent purchasers has been our Eforms site, which shortened the wait time on approvals, but can only be used for trusts, since they won't accept fingerprint cards, signatures, and photos online...

Can we add another benefit that the members of your trust can also use the silencer, legally, and also trade freely without having to do another stamp?

[randyrucker]

Excuse the daft question from the UK, but what is the purpose of having an NFA trust?

Because of US laws (the NFA in this case), there are 2 routes to ownership of suppressors and other items regulated by said act (such as short-barrelled rifles and shotguns...you guys in UK i believe dont have to worry about such things, because if i remember right, once you are licensed for a firearm, you can modify it however you choose other than making it fully automatic...)
the 2 choices are:
1) purchase in your own name (which requires your local chief law enforcement officer to sign, for you to submit fingerprint cards, and also for you to submit passport-like photos...
-OR-
2) form a trust to place the items in, which doesn't require any of the above.

An added bonus for some recent purchasers has been our Eforms site, which shortened the wait time on approvals, but can only be used for trusts, since they won't accept fingerprint cards, signatures, and photos online...

Can we add another benefit that the members of your trust can also use the silencer, legally, and also trade freely without having to do another stamp?

You make it sound like a trust is a club. Only the trustee or a designated assistant trustee can use the NFA item. Anyone who is a trustee of the trust can use any of the NFA items in the trust. Each NFA item must have a stamp.

[weejub]

Excuse the daft question from the UK, but what is the purpose of having an NFA trust?

Because of US laws (the NFA in this case), there are 2 routes to ownership of suppressors and other items regulated by said act (such as short-barrelled rifles and shotguns...you guys in UK i believe dont have to worry about such things, because if i remember right, once you are licensed for a firearm, you can modify it however you choose other than making it fully automatic...)
the 2 choices are:
1) purchase in your own name (which requires your local chief law enforcement officer to sign, for you to submit fingerprint cards, and also for you to submit passport-like photos...
-OR-
2) form a trust to place the items in, which doesn't require any of the above.

An added bonus for some recent purchasers has been our Eforms site, which shortened the wait time on approvals, but can only be used for trusts, since they won't accept fingerprint cards, signatures, and photos online...

Can we add another benefit that the members of your trust can also use the silencer, legally, and also trade freely without having to do another stamp?[/quote]


You make it sound like a trust is a club. Only the trustee or a designated assistant trustee can use the NFA item. Anyone who is a trustee of the trust can use any of the NFA items in the trust. Each NFA item must have a stamp.[/quote]

I like that - a club - a fraternity of silence.

[plant.one]

NFA item possession owned by a trust is not limited to the trustee's/alternate successor trustees/successor trustee's. [edited for correction] in all states.[/edit]

trustee's and beneficiary's are both allowed possession/use of NFA Items owned by the trust [edit] in some states [/edit]. in my trust the primary difference is that only trustee's are allowed to add or remove (sell) items owned by the trust. beneficiary's can only use/possess items already registered to the trust.

the trust "owns" the item and thats who the stamp is registered to, but any member of the trust who otherwise meets the legal qualifications of possession can legally be in possession of the NFA item.

for example - a minor who's a trust beneficiary would have to have another member of the trust with them to use a NFA item in the trust until they're of legal age to posess it on their own.

Obviously they need to have proper paperwork on hand proving as such their membership in the trust, etc.

there's no swapping or trading so to speak - without of course going through the standard NFA transfer process and $200 stamp again - but if you and several family member for example have a NFA trust any item in that trust can be kept with any member of the trust. the ownership never changes, just the person in possession at the time.


vs a non trust situation where an individual is who the stamp is registered to - if a family member wanted to use the NFA item in question the person who the stamp (and NFA item) is registered to has to be there with the item.

This was one of the very reasons i went the trust route - that way i can leave my suppressor at my parents if i'm going to be making several trips to visit in short succession and by having my mother as a registered member of the trust it keeps them out of any legal fooey of being in possession of a NFA item thats not registered to them. It saves me from traveling a NFA item back and forth several times a year.

[randyrucker]

NFA item possession owned by a trust is not limited to the trustee's/alternate successor trustees/successor trustee's.

trustee's and beneficiary's are both allowed possession/use of NFA Items owned by the trust. in my trust the primary difference is that only trustee's are allowed to add or remove (sell) items owned by the trust. beneficiary's can only use/possess items already registered to the trust.

That's news to me. Can you provide source data for your information regarding this? It contradicts the NFA FAQ. There is no limit to the amount of trustees there can be, but everthing I read says the beneficiary has no direct interest in the trust until the grantor dies and cannot possess NFA trust items.


NFA trust FAQ:

21. May a beneficiary of the trust possess the items regulated by the National firearms Act?

No, only the trustee may possess the items Regulated by the National firearms act. The Trustee must be eighteen years of age to possess the items regulated by the National Firearms Act. The Trustee must be twenty one years of age to purchase items regulated by the National firearms Act.

[plant.one]

let me double check with my lawyer. im pretty sure that was a specific question i asked when setting up the trust.

care to share the link to that NFA trust FAQ thats sourced from?

[plant.one]

with just a quick google search i came up with this

http://blog.princelaw.com/2011/01/12/gu ... questions/

additionally my trust clearly states

Fifth: The Trustee shal maintain the Trust Property for the benefit of the Trust Beneficiaries and shall allow the Trust Beneficaries the full use of the Trust property in complaince with all local, state and federal laws at his sole discresion

[edited for clarity]

[randyrucker]

with just a quick google search i came up with this

http://blog.princelaw.com/2011/01/12/gu ... questions/

additionally my trust clearly states

Fifth: The Trustee shal maintain the Trust Property for the benefit of the Trust Beneficiaries and shall allow the Trust Beneficaries the full use of the Trust property in complaince with all local, state and federal laws at his sole discresion

[edited for clarity]

Looks like some conflicting information.

http://www.texasnfatrust.com/products.htm
http://www.floridanfa.com/nfa-trust-faqs.html
http://www.georgianfatrust.com/nfa-trus ... -faqs.html


There are also many other sites that say beneficiaries cannot use NFA items. The Prince law firm is th only place I can find that says a "life beneficiary can use them". I'm not sure yet if there is a difference between a life beneficiary and the trust beneficary. I'll keep looking.