cdl wrote: ↑Wed Oct 09, 2019 2:16 am
As long as your going to the trouble ... and I haven't done this with 300 Blk yet.
I call "Case Symmetry" the uniformity of case wall thickness and "Run Out" as the straightness of the completed cartridge, but that's me because concentricity gets me confused.
So, measure the case wall symmetry (wall thickness) behind the shoulder. Because a non symmetrical case expands like a banana. When I do Lapua 308 Win brass, those out of symmetry between 0.0015" < 0.0030" get indexed, over 0.0030" get culled. Out of 100 Lapua 308 Win, on average, 20% get culled for being too light, too heavy, non- symmetrical or for just bothering me. 40% end up indexed and 40% are pretty "darn" symmetrical.
What's counter intuitive is that the indexed rounds shoot almost twice as tight as the "darn" symmetrical rounds.
The moral here is that I expend all that effort to find and shoot the crooked rounds when it counts.
With the indexed... Are the markings on these just to segregate from the remaining 40% that are "near perfect"? Do you try differing techniques or additional case prep to help balance these?
I find the thin side, mark them 180 degrees to the other side. Small groove on head stamp. Rem 700 bolt, insert with mark at 3:00, bolt closes and drags it to 6:00. They banana down and wear the lower throat first.
The ideal of the index is to always do it the same. Including seating the bullet, resizing, whatever. I suppose you could index anywhere as long as it’s the same but once upon a time, I read the top of the throat gets the most wear and this just became the way I do it to compensate.
Since there’s no such thing as a perfect bullet, the next best thing is a consistent imperfection.
I get it. I'm using my loads in an AR-15 so indexing might not work, but I'll mark some cases and load the magazine and check indexing as they come out...
Its an idea at least with more precision rounds.
Had a great day at the range this weekend. Finally got some spectacular SD/ES results after a ton of trial and error (probably all human error anyway).
Finalized loadings on my 110 tac tx.
Finished Maker 190gn load - surprisingly this is my most accurate shooting bullet..
- Weird but I'll take it! Sub rounds still show some very large ES swings *After some back reading through posts I'm probably just going to bit the bullet and purchase a K&M Shooting neck turning kit... Seems to be the best kit from what I've read (Just got their tapered reamer in... this pup is slow but very good! Definitely noticed some differences in bullet seating.
Went back to loading on the Hornady AP press over my Lyman Turret - getting much more consistent headspace bumps... Roughly 0.001 max variation on this last batch.
Also digging the Redding Type S die I purchased for 223 (using over old RCBS) - Same results with Redding die.. So much easier forming and great headspace consistency.
Hopefully weekend after next Ill have some Gold Dot 150s loaded up for trials. Working to get my buds 270 Win finished this weekend.
Subs and low ES can be a tough thing to get in the same sentence, Unless you will be shooting 100 yards plus, go with what is most accurate, smallest group. Fifty and under it just doesn't matter.
As far a indexing your cases and rounds, that is a long time practice of cast or single shot rifle shooters. Some cast guys go as far as making an index mark in the mold so not only the case, but the bullet is in the bore the same way every time.
If you want to check your loading consistency, load at the shooting bench and take the same case and shoot four times indexed at 12, 3, 6, 9. If you can load the same case clocked at 12 and shoot one hole, then shooting the four points should make a square, three at each should have four distinct groups.
Dellet, I'll try this next trip out.. I'm not quite sure my personal skills may be developed enough as of yet tho...
Purchased an igaging ball micrometer.. I'm also loading for my boss at work.. (he's the primary benefactor) and I've noticed all this Remington 270 brass is absolutely horrible!
Neck turning seemed like the next logical expenditure. (Needed for blackout or not) .. I guess for me will neck turning definitively help subs es/sd or ? Dellet, what's the best or most consistent you've been able to load subs for?
At the moment my subs are all grouping .75-1.25" at 100.. As many problems that I have getting a good or consistent ojive to base measurement on these 190gn Makers they've been extremely accurate. Yet I still cannot get es's below 100..
Finished doing a couple 150GD loads with 1680. So this coming weekend is going to be extremely busy! Close to 300 rounds to check on 4 weapons Good times! !
It gets confusing when you jump around with loads and don’t provide any data.
You have something going on with a Barnes 110 and H110, 150 gold dots and 1680, and a 190 Maker with an unknown powder.
I think they Maker is the one with the high ES issue. Knowing the powder used would be helpful.
Honestly, it sounds like the problem is too many loads and not enough experience. It sounds like you have at least 3 Blackout loads going on right now and then loads for 3-4 other guns and cartridges. You’ve loaded 100’s of rounds that you have no idea how they will perform. Sounds confusing to me.
I’m really only able to work up one load at a time effectively, people that can work five or six or ten at a time have my respect.
Thank you very much for this information. I currently have 100 of the 190grn Maker bullets to reload and have never found any information for even a starting load. This should at least get me a starting point.
RupertBearz wrote: ↑Wed Oct 23, 2019 11:58 am
Thank you very much for this information. I currently have 100 of the 190grn Maker bullets to reload and have never found any information for even a starting load. This should at least get me a starting point.
Be VERY careful with COAL... Base To Ogive.... I had to push mine back so much further than most any other 300bo sub... the tips on these Makers are very BLUNT... so make sure to measure your chamber with an OAL gauge - I just formed a case then cut the neck up to reduce tension...
I'm debating an attempt with N120 as A1680's Extreme Spread is so wide. GL with the 190 Makers.. I find them extremely accurate regardless of the spread in FPS.
PS my barrel length is 8" so you may need to decrease powder depending on barrel length.
FYI - work your own loads up but I found 9.6 H110 to be stable around the 1070fps range.
