Liberty Chaotic Ti or Dead Air Nomad 30, or?

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John A.
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Re: Liberty Chaotic Ti or Dead Air Nomad 30, or?

Post by John A. »

Congratulations on the purchase. I think you'll be really happy with it.

I read earlier this month that the NFA branch exceeded 800,000 suppressors in the registry this year.

Not too bad considering they say the machineguns in the entire country is about 500,000 which is absurd. They do not have accurate records obviously, otherwise the number of machineguns would be much higher. There are twice many more active military than that alone, not counting every police agency and alphabet agency in the country is also exempt. But I digress. Sorry for the derailment.

I'd love for you to update the topic once you get it, or get some range time with it while it's in atf jail if you dealer has a range that he'll let you use it at during the long wait. My last can was a little more than 5 months, but there weren't two transfers involved either. Dealer to Dealer transfers are going pretty quick, maybe about 2 weeks right now thanks to the changes they made last year making 3 separate nfa branches concerning transfer types. Industry (dealers), Government, and civilian. So, it shouldn't take too much longer these days.

If that is the one with the wipe, I may shoot it once with the wipe just to see how it sounds, and then take it out before range time and then put the wipe back in for serious work since it will help mitigate some of the sound inside the cab of your truck.
When those totally ignorant of firearms make laws, you end up with totally ignorant firearm laws.
Shushh
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Re: Liberty Chaotic Ti or Dead Air Nomad 30, or?

Post by Shushh »

Thanks, yeah clearly suppressors are selling like crazy, it's big biz right now. Gives hope for getting them deregulated but as soon as the Rs lost the house I knew it wasn't happening soon.

Of course I'll post up what I learn when I can finally send lead through it. Don't know how useful it will be, I don't have a lot of experience to judge by, but happy to do what I can.

I never even considered that I might be able to shoot it while it's in NFA jail if I used a dealer with a range. There was a dealer with a range I talked to about it but they wanted a ridiculous $200 just for their part of the transfer. Jerks even lied about them having to do a form 3 and paying for that. They aren't going to get a single dime from me, ever. Went with a different FFL with no range but with a better reputation that only wanted $50, totally reasonable for their effort. On the transfer stuff my understanding is I can't do anything on my form 4 until the can is at my FFL. But Meplat sounds good about getting their form 3 and the shipping done without delay. FWIW I set up a gun trust as well, I hope that at least makes the form 4 a bit easier. The trust company has a form generator thing and all that jazz.

Yeah it's the one with the wipe, I'll absolutely shoot it with the wipe, probably quite a bit, at the very least to do a fair amount of testing of sound and POI. I have no doubt I'll buy what I need to just make the wipes, so shooting one out won't be a big deal. I'm also kinda hoping I can shoot it in the house. I don't have a basement but I do have a safe direction in case it goes through the wall and enough skills to make a bullet trap.
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John A.
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Re: Liberty Chaotic Ti or Dead Air Nomad 30, or?

Post by John A. »

The wipe will wear out pretty quickly, but you are correct that it's good to know what to expect and how much POI shift to expect with it. That's very wise. But for normal range trips, I doubt that I would shoot through the wipe much. I don't have any hands on with them, but I've heard they degrade pretty bad after as little as 10 shots through them.

You were also right about using a better dealer. I don't like anyone that does underhanded things and that's pretty bad.

$50 for a transfer from a good dealer is fine. That's actually really good because the ones around here charge $100. But I understand why. It's not just the paperwork and transfers they have to deal with, but they are maintaining insurance on it in case of theft or damage from floods or fires and such and stumbling over it for months at a time. :lol:
When those totally ignorant of firearms make laws, you end up with totally ignorant firearm laws.
Shushh
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Re: Liberty Chaotic Ti or Dead Air Nomad 30, or?

Post by Shushh »

Yeah, I can't see bothering with the wipe on a range trip where I don't need to do any wipe testing. Don't do me any good to be extra quiet when there's others shooting.

I do have some ideas on the wipe I want to try out though. I think I mentioned one, the wipe they provide is solid. I think if I punched a hole the size of the meplat that would do a lot to eliminate POI shift. Similarly maybe if I scored it so it ripped evenly it'd last a bit longer and have less POI shift. We'll see, I'll play around.

Yeah if I was the FFL, having to store the thing for so long would be the worst part. But at least suppressors are small, I can't imagine a dealer that does a lot of machine gun transfers, how much space and money they'd have tied up in waiting for the ATF.

I don't know how reliable it is, but I was told once that the ATF Form 4 delay is artificial. That it's not caused by the background check, or a backlog, but that they just sit on it for a while.
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John A.
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Re: Liberty Chaotic Ti or Dead Air Nomad 30, or?

Post by John A. »

Just know that you can't make more than 1 replacement at a time.
When those totally ignorant of firearms make laws, you end up with totally ignorant firearm laws.
Shushh
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Re: Liberty Chaotic Ti or Dead Air Nomad 30, or?

Post by Shushh »

John A. wrote:Just know that you can't make more than 1 replacement at a time.
Well to my understanding more accurately I can't even have more then one at a time. So I can't make another until I destroy the old one by cutting it up. But I should be able to make them on site. Take the old one out, cut it up, then punch another out of a sheet of silicone.
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John A.
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Re: Liberty Chaotic Ti or Dead Air Nomad 30, or?

Post by John A. »

Pretty much. I'm not a lawyer though.
When those totally ignorant of firearms make laws, you end up with totally ignorant firearm laws.
Shushh
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Re: Liberty Chaotic Ti or Dead Air Nomad 30, or?

Post by Shushh »

Update..... Got the Vox out of ATF jail some months ago, everything I could reasonably expect. I had it mounted with Key-mo but recently to make it just short enough to fit my bag I changed to direct thread. The wipes are quite easy to make and replace.
Uncle Fester
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Re: Liberty Chaotic Ti or Dead Air Nomad 30, or?

Post by Uncle Fester »

I have the Nomad and it works as promised. If I was doing it again, I would get the new Ti version because the Nomad with the Key-Mo adaptor makes things a little front heavy.
silverhawk500
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Re: Liberty Chaotic Ti or Dead Air Nomad 30, or?

Post by silverhawk500 »

John A. wrote: Wed Dec 05, 2018 10:20 am I appreciate and understand why you would write out a pro/con list. I find myself doing that too. And it does look like you answered most of your own questions. And while many of the options of the dead air make it stand out, and to which you said you weren't really interested in the first/last place, look at what that does to the cost.
If you have the extra $300 or so to spend and are interested, get the dead air. Simply because of the additional internal muzzlebrake and a little more versatility down the road. That will help protect the blast baffle in your expansion chamber and will move some of the gas sideways and out away from the bore and may make it a little more quiet. Just know that if you don't buy/use it, you may be adding some serious first round pop due to the absence of it and having so much more space in your expansion chamber. And that's not something you need or want in the confines of a truck cab in case you ever had to use it. You may could pre-fill it with a gel ablative in absence of the internal brake, but you can also do that with the Liberty can too, even though it may not be necessary it wouldn't hurt the can and would still improve the db rating a little too. Just don't use anything caustic or toxic. Many guys like wire pulling gel. Don't squirt it full. Just a light coating around the inside of the baffle/spacer is all you need for it to work.
But for a basic can that performs well out of the box with no fuss, I'd go with the Liberty. It sounds pretty darn good really, and Liberty is a good company. Not saying that dead air isn't, but it's hard to beat Dave. He and I have talked a lot in the past.OK, down to the nitty gritty.
The Inconel baffle are super hard and hold up better to heat. The rest of the monocore and the outer tube will melt before that baffle will.The first suppressor that I ever made, I used simple, basic, engine valve spring retainers for baffles, which was made from 300M steel. Many don't know, but that's probably about as close to the next step down below Inconel for all intents and purposes.
I have used that can with a lot of guns over the last decade ranging from 22lr up to 308 and rates of fire from a single shot up to full auto. It has held up really well. Other than fouling and some carbon build up on the face of the baffles, I can see no real detrimental wear on them. If you're just going to be shooting subs only, it's serious over-kill. Though you can still use the can on 223 and 270, 243, 6.8 spc, 6.5 Grendel and others so it gives you enough versatility to still be useful in the future.Just my humble 2 cents.
I would go with the Chaotic Ti simply based on my experience with the Chaotics and the new Ti with the Iconel blast baffle and the rest Ti, great can, small size, great price. Be Safe,
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