Has anyone ever been asked to show their stamps?

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TobyJ
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Has anyone ever been asked to show their stamps?

Post by TobyJ »

I keep copies of mine, just in case, but I'm just curious if anyone here has ever been asked by some form of LE to produce theirs.

Here in AZ, I don't think there is much motivation on the state or local levels to regulate NFA stuff, so I think it's pretty unlikely...but it doesn't hurt to carry copies.

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Wahoo95
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Re: Has anyone ever been asked to show their stamps?

Post by Wahoo95 »

Only time I've been asked was by a local range once time. Then there was another time when we were approached by some Va Wildlife Officers while at class 3 shoot with several other forum members from another forum. They rolled up on us after hearing all the F/A gunfire. They uncomfortably asked if all of our paperwork was in order. I could tell that they weren't sure what they were asking about so we offered to show them the paperwork so they'd have a better understanding.

My opinion is that unless its an ATF Agent or another person who has an interest in NFA items anyone asking wouldn't know what they were looking at or what to ask for so most simply don't ask.
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DoubleJ
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Re: Has anyone ever been asked to show their stamps?

Post by DoubleJ »

Never had anyone ask, but my range is semi-private, so very few people actually see my stuff. I do carry copies, originals in the safe, just in case. It's my understanding that local LE isn't even supposed to ask, as NFA stuff is out of their jurisdiction, but if one did, I'd be more than happy to share some knowledge with him, show him that we're not bad guys or assassins or whatever. Of course, I'm sure some F/A rat-a-tat-tat probably draws more attention than pew-ding. I'd best most of the shooters around me aren't even placing the sound they're hearing, if they hear it all through their muffs.
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TMD
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Re: Has anyone ever been asked to show their stamps?

Post by TMD »

Technically the only one that you are required to show your stamps to is the ATF. Here's the catch. A ranger master can ask you to leave if you refuse and a LE officer can arrest you as well. Sure after you're booked and charged it will more than likely be dismissed but is it worth the hassle? I keep copies in my range bag, gun cases, glove box and a digital copy on my phone. Better safe than sorry.

In a side note I did one time have an old codger approach me at my local range and asked it prove my cans were legal because he was concerned for his safety. I asked him if he worked at the range and he didn't. In a not so polite way I told him to go F himself. He left and I stayed and enjoyed my session.
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steven11b
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Re: Has anyone ever been asked to show their stamps?

Post by steven11b »

I get asked regularly by other citizens. Guy asked me today if it was a supressor since silencers are illegal. I also habe gotten asked when I go to public ranges if I have a "license" for my items. I just smile and say sure.
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dellet
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Re: Has anyone ever been asked to show their stamps?

Post by dellet »

I am pretty open to people who ask, but I am rarely in public. The range I belong to is private, but hold a fair amount of public events. Paper from non members must be presented before they are allowed to shoot at open events. If they are my guest, I am responsible for knowing if their weapon is legal.

Range/club policy is notify any officer on your first item and they can ask to see your paperwork, your choice, show it or leave if they ask to. Same with RO's.

This also helps when someone calls an officer to report a crazed lunatic shooting machine guns at the 50 yard berm. Then they can simply reply to tell the jackwagon to move to the 200 yard range where there is a mountain for a backstop instead of a 15 foot berm.

This was done as a liability issue for the club and education for members. You would be surprised how many non-papered SBR's are out there, and people that have no clue they are committing felonies.

We've had a couple of issues over the years. When the club first started hosting cowboy shoots there were a fair amount of 16" shotguns coming in without paper work.

The other issue was a bunch of locals who made their own exclusive club, and a few of the more upstanding of their members joined the gun club so everyone else could shoot as guests. It seems these guys took it as a personal challenge to have at least one violation from every department of the renamed BATFE.

It was at that point we decided it was a lot easier for members to police their own than to have the feds do it for us.
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QuietMike
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Re: Has anyone ever been asked to show their stamps?

Post by QuietMike »

Never.

When I was a LEO, I had to ask some guys for theirs. A nervous Nelly neighbor called about someone shooting machine guns in the area. I knew the caller listened to the scanner as she was just that type of busybody.

After I looked at their papers, I told dispatch they were prefectly legal to shoot full auto, all the while imagining the old lady caller having a fit.
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Re: Has anyone ever been asked to show their stamps?

Post by InMyHumbleOpinion »

DoubleJ wrote:Never had anyone ask, but my range is semi-private, so very few people actually see my stuff. I do carry copies, originals in the safe, just in case. It's my understanding that local LE isn't even supposed to ask, as NFA stuff is out of their jurisdiction, but if one did, I'd be more than happy to share some knowledge with him, show him that we're not bad guys or assassins or whatever. Of course, I'm sure some F/A rat-a-tat-tat probably draws more attention than pew-ding. I'd best most of the shooters around me aren't even placing the sound they're hearing, if they hear it all through their muffs.
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thisguysguns
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Re: Has anyone ever been asked to show their stamps?

Post by thisguysguns »

I've only been asked by a range officer once, but it wasn't because he was being overzealous. He asked to see my tax stamp because he'd never seen one before. I don't keep a physical copy with me at all times, but I do have a digital copy on my phone 24/7. Some people are a little weird about that, however, if the ATF is perfectly fine sending digital copies of approved form 1s directly to my hotmail account, I feel like I'm safe presenting a digital copy if asked. It's a lot easier than toting around a binder full of tax stamps whenever I go to the range.
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John A.
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Re: Has anyone ever been asked to show their stamps?

Post by John A. »

No, I have not ever been asked.

The 4th amendment protects the right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

With that said, now that the new nfa regs concerning 41 f or 41p or whatever that presidential executive order is, a copy of the form 1 or 4 is now officially mailed to the cleo in your area, so I assume the 4th amendment goes out the window just like this administration wants to do with the 2nd and those 1st amendment free zones they set up from time to time.

Since the NFA has been transferred from the Treasury Department to the Justice Department many years ago, I assume that any officer can now ask to see the paperwork (and not just a revenuer), and I may would probably comply, but again, would largely be determined by the officer(s) themselves. Most LEO are ignorant of NFA laws and processes as it is and even with the paperwork, that does not guarantee that they wouldn't arrest you say to you to "tell it to the judge" anyway.

One way they can always check to see if a weapon that they believe should be registered is to physically pick up their cell phone and call the nfa branch and give them the serial number because all NFA weapons are registered by serial in that database, even if you do not have a copy of your paperwork with you.
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