SBR Interstate transport

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Sharkbite
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Re: SBR Interstate transport

Post by Sharkbite » Tue Jan 22, 2019 5:18 pm

And the appropriate and legal reaction to these "sbr related questions" would be "am I being detained" and "where is your ATF badge?"
Ok Slick, its apparent you are one of those “Sovereign citizen” types so here are my answers to your questions above.

“Yes, you are being detained, on suspicion of possessing an unregistered short barreled rifle. A federal felony. If you can show me an approved form 1 or 4, we can all be on our way. If not, im going to arrest you, and we can figure it out later.”

You may beat the charge, but you wont beat the ride to jail or the time while i figure out if its a legal gun or not.

So play your silly games, think you can just ride around without the paperwork for your SBR/SBS/MG and no LEO can ask to see those documents because they are “tax documents”. You are wrong and your wake up call will be ugly. Just like all the idiots that wont Register their cars or get drivers licenses and get yanked out of the car after having their windows broken.

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thisguysguns
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Re: SBR Interstate transport

Post by thisguysguns » Tue Jan 22, 2019 5:27 pm

You know, just fill out the forms and submit them ASAP and hope the government opens up and the form gets approved in time. Make sure you have a backup plan, however. Prepare a full rifle length upper (if you have one) or another firearm to take with you should it not come back in time. Yes, the government sucks, and yes, these laws are stupid. I personally choose to avoid pushing the boundaries because I don't want to lose what I have.

For what it's worth, I filled one of these out for a pig hunt in Texas two weeks before I was scheduled to get on a plane, and the stupid approved form showed up in my mail box the day after I left. Needless to say, my SBR stayed home and I took a different weapon.

Also, I didn't see a single pig hunting on public land. Sad hunting, but great memories with my family out in the woods.
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golfindia
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Re: SBR Interstate transport

Post by golfindia » Tue Jan 22, 2019 5:28 pm

Sharkbite wrote:
Ok Slick, its apparent you are one of those “Sovereign citizen” types so here are my answers to your questions above.

“Yes, you are being detained, on suspicion of possessing an unregistered short barreled rifle. A federal felony. If you can show me an approved form 1 or 4, we can all be on our way. If not, im going to arrest you, and we can figure it out later.”

You may beat the charge, but you wont beat the ride to jail or the time while i figure out if its a legal gun or not.

So play your silly games, think you can just ride around without the paperwork for your SBR/SBS/MG and no LEO can ask to see those documents because they are “tax documents”. You are wrong and your wake up call will be ugly. Just like all the idiots that wont Register their cars or get drivers licenses and get yanked out of the car after having their windows broken.
Wow. You sound wonderful. Sure making a lot of inferences about me.... Hopefully the lawsuit wont go too badly either.

Sharkbite
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Re: SBR Interstate transport

Post by Sharkbite » Tue Jan 22, 2019 5:31 pm

What's the probable cause for further detainment? Suspicion of illegal SBR?
. YES
I doubt most LE would know the distinction, or care unless in NY, CA, NJ,
. You are SOMEWHAT correct (im an oddity). Most LEO’s have very little knowledge of NFA laws and the paperwork involved. MOST will see an SBR as illegal on its face.

You showing an approved form 1 or 4 may show them otherwise. Or you can just hope for the best. In my world hope is not a plan

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dellet
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Re: SBR Interstate transport

Post by dellet » Tue Jan 22, 2019 5:42 pm

golfindia wrote:No. You still have it all wrong and the hypothetical situation is assinine.

But like I said. You are welcome to do whatever you think is correct. The more compliant citizens there are, the happier everyone will be.
If you have never had a firearm checked in the field by a Game Warden, you either don't hunt much, are lucky enough to never hunt public lands, or the states you hunt in, do not have game check stations on public roads where hunters are required to stop.

Traveling interstate with a firearm is actually a lot less complicated than traveling interstate and hunting with one. The situation I described, minus the possible NFA issues, happens everyday of hunting season multiple times, and in many States.

Yes, oddly enough most hunters do cooperate for two reasons, in most states it's the law and you agree to comply when issued your licence, or ethical hunters would like to see a thinning of the herd of idiots in the field and are happy to have friendly interactions with Wardens.

As for Wardens sorting out NFA issues in the field with someone who won't produce paper work, not going to happen. The difference is that he is getting paid by the hour to be there and sort it out, and you are paying by the hour to keep him from doing it.
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golfindia
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Re: SBR Interstate transport

Post by golfindia » Tue Jan 22, 2019 7:07 pm

Hundreds and hundreds maybe thousands of hours hunting on state and private lands since I was a kid. Nobody has ever asked me any questions. Walk and drive right by all of the officers with sbrs and silencers, which are legal for hunting here. Nothing. Ever. Nobody I know has ever been asked any questions. The LEOs here are well aware that it's out of their lane, and unless you're a felon with warrants and out of season does in your truck they aren't going to look at anything except what is in their wheelhouse. Permit, license, antler size, bag limit and carry on. Too much risk for them if they mess something up and get sued. It's the same reason no LEOs would sign off on form 1 and 4 pre 41p. They all said "local leo will not be in the Fed firearm review business". There's a public state run gun range here. I've shot silencers and sbrs next to LEO. Never any questions.

It's unfortunate that people are getting hounded every day in other states because their gun looks "suspicious".

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John A.
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Re: SBR Interstate transport

Post by John A. » Tue Jan 22, 2019 7:19 pm

golfindia wrote:It's the same reason no LEOs would sign off on form 1 and 4 pre 41p.
I have gotten 7 F1's signed from 3 different elected sheriffs from 2002 to 41p last year. I have never had one tell me they wouldn't sign.

Doesn't sound like I'm the one who lives in unfriendly territory. Thankfully.
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Re: SBR Interstate transport

Post by rlandry6 » Tue Jan 22, 2019 8:42 pm

After all of this discussion, the prudent thing to do is learn the laws as they apply to traveling and your destination.
If not, you need to ask yourself two questions.

1. Do I want to be a test case?

2. Do I feel lucky today?
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dellet
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Re: SBR Interstate transport

Post by dellet » Tue Jan 22, 2019 8:45 pm

golfindia wrote:Hundreds and hundreds maybe thousands of hours hunting on state and private lands since I was a kid. Nobody has ever asked me any questions. Walk and drive right by all of the officers with sbrs and silencers, which are legal for hunting here. Nothing. Ever. Nobody I know has ever been asked any questions. The LEOs here are well aware that it's out of their lane, and unless you're a felon with warrants and out of season does in your truck they aren't going to look at anything except what is in their wheelhouse. Permit, license, antler size, bag limit and carry on. Too much risk for them if they mess something up and get sued. It's the same reason no LEOs would sign off on form 1 and 4 pre 41p. They all said "local leo will not be in the Fed firearm review business". There's a public state run gun range here. I've shot silencers and sbrs next to LEO. Never any questions.

It's unfortunate that people are getting hounded every day in other states because their gun looks "suspicious".
Nice that things are so wide open there I guess, but that's the exception any more I think. Most places have people in the field that know their job well enough they can check for things like magazine capacity of a shotgun or rifle if applicable. They know the local firearms laws for hunting and how to enforce them. They can tell the difference, know how to check and will see if a 700 Remington is a muzzle loader or cartridge rifle. The any weapon, any time, any game, any area places to hunt are all but gone, you're really lucky to live in one.

Here during regular season or areas any pistol is acceptable.

In some of the fringe or extended seasons it would be considered "traditional handgun" straight walled cartridges only. That applies to special access areas also. In those instances, someone with an AR pistol will certainly be required to show proof of compliance. Honestly, I would be pissed if someone with an AR pistol in a traditional handgun only area, was not considered a bit suspicious.
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rebel
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Re: SBR Interstate transport

Post by rebel » Tue Jan 22, 2019 10:55 pm

I think to rephrase the OP's question is - "How can I hunt out of state with my SBR with the least amount of trouble?"
That being said, and golfindia, I know you and I have butted heads on other issues, just fax the form.
In my state Game Wardens are the best trained LEOs in the field. The training is tougher and longer than Parris Island for the USMC. They make drug/alcohol, gun, and domestic arrests. After reading this I called the regional Lt. who informed me that this would definitely ruin a guys out of state hunt. He said as soon as he saw the engraved receiver, it would cause concern.
Hog hunting in the South means folks come from all over to hunt them, bringing all kinds of weapons to hunt them. Our wardens have been well educated as to what is legal.
Now, conversely - I think the form is BS. I agree with golfindia it is overreach. I think it's a clear form of control, however, giving a NC game warden an answer of "you have no authority" is a damn good way of wearing iron handcuffs.
Why take the chance? LEO's enforce the laws on the books, sometimes as they interpret it. Not worth losing a rifle and bail money.
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