Carry copy of trust?

[68Guy]

OK so I fully understand that I need to carry a (readable) copy of my tax stamps with my SBR and suppressor. One thing that I don't think I have found so far is do I also need to carry a copy of (any of) my trust that the devices are actually registered to? I was thinking about that because nowhere on the tax stamp does MY name show up as it is registered to the trust. How does this actually proved to a LEO that I am lawfully allowed to possess the item?

If the answer is yes I do - then do I need ALL the pages of the trust or just say the first page that assigns me as the settlor?

[IMGrunt]

Is it required...no. If you're name isn't part of the Trust name on your stamp...smart to carry it or have it nearby just to save you an explanation and a free ride somewhere. What to carry...I'd recommend the Certificate of Trust and/or the Appointment of Trustee page(s).

[BadKarmaZeroSix]

Some have said you dont even need the copies of tax stamps, since technically they are personal tax documents and nobody short of an IRS auditor can request them...i DONT agree with this, would rather relieve any concerns about legality of my NFA items at the range rather than in a courtroom as i attempt to get my firearms back from being seized...im still rather new to the NFA world, but one of the first things i thought to do was have a copy of all stamps scanned to a flash drive, as well as a scanned copy of my trust with all schedules, place in a ziploc with a silica gel packet, and keep in the pistol grip...i would rather be safe than on the legal defense...i STILL havent found definitive requirements, but i think it would be smart to be able to show your stamps AND show that your trust is actually YOUR trust...

[jryock]

My lawyer advised me to keep a copy of my trust and tax stamp with each NFA item.
Because...
(1) the tax stamp provides proof that the item is registered to the "XYZ TRUST"; and
(2) the trust document provides proof that you personally have the authority to possess that item registered by "XYZ TRUST".

ALSO... my state (Virginia) has a law on the books that limits possession of "sawed-off" rifles and shotguns to LEO, military, and others legally allowed (ATF approved persons). So local LEOs can ask for registration or detain you until it is verifed that you are legally allowed to possess that item.

[g22rmr]

According to the ATF
http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/nationa ... r-evidence


Q: Does the owner of a registered NFA firearm have to have any evidence to show it is registered lawfully to him or her?

Yes. The approved application received from ATF serves as evidence of registration of the NFA firearm in the owner’s name. This document must be kept available for inspection by ATF officers. It is suggested that a photocopy of the approved application be carried by the owner when the weapon is being transported.


If you feel bold, you can refuse to show anyone but an ATF officer. But I'm not sure how such refusal will do anything but hurt or hassle you. In all actuality, its private tax paperwork between you and the government. Does local police have any right to view you tax return to see if you aren't in fact a dangerous income tax protestor? Supreme Court has ruled that the default condition for citizens carrying firearms is that they are Not Felons and cannot be detained until it is determined that they are in fact not felons. But they have yet to rule in such a manner regarding NFA items.

[randyrucker]

Is it required...no. If you're name isn't part of the Trust name on your stamp...smart to carry it or have it nearby just to save you an explanation and a free ride somewhere. What to carry...I'd recommend the Certificate of Trust and/or the Appointment of Trustee page(s).

Can you post a sample Appointment of Trust page? Thanks.

[rebel]

I made copies of my stamp. Shrunk them and put them in whatever I would be carrying the can in. Did not make copies of the trust, just the stamp. If it gets that hairy I am in big trouble anyway and they can ask the wife for a copy.

[jryock]

The Certificate of Trust is only a short form to show that the trust exists (say to set up a bank account or such). You will need the Declaration of Trust and any amendments to verify you are a Trustee.

This is also the case for my Subordinate Trustees. For example... my mother, who does not have my last name, can handle the NFA item since she is a subordinate trustee and legally allowed to possess trust property. So, it makes sense to have all appropriate docs available at any time.

[L1A1Rocker]

It's still your signature at the bottom of the Form 1/4. You sign it as "John Doe, Trustee". If a cop is not going to accept that; it's a pretty sure bet he's not accepting anything you give him. He's already decided you're going downtown.

[jryock]

It's still your signature at the bottom of the Form 1/4. You sign it as "John Doe, Trustee". If a cop is not going to accept that; it's a pretty sure bet he's not accepting anything you give him. He's already decided you're going downtown.

You are probably right on that one. At that point the only words I would say are "lawyer" and "search warrant" since that officer has decided to ignore the obvious.