Newb with a RARR, can, heavy subs, pistol powder.

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Sgtis108
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Re: Newb with a RARR, can, heavy subs, pistol powder.

Post by Sgtis108 » Mon Feb 12, 2018 9:07 pm

rebel wrote:
2manyToys wrote:Don't write off that N105 before you try it. It's my favorite quiet powder for heavy subs. It can also cycle an AR, in case you go down that path.

My RARR does very well with with N105 and 190-220gn bullets. You may want to read through the stickies, especially the one for single shot pet loads.
This^^^^^^
105 is a great powder that will provide you with decent case fill. Titegroup and the like - yeah, you can shoot it but ES is rough and being new to the round, you can get get to over pressure in a heartbeat. Hell, you can do it even if you are an expert. One can get into trouble quick with the uber fast powders. They are very quiet, and will blow a primer in a zinute. As I said, case fill with these isn't great with a lot of powder laying horizontal in the case. Not picking on you because your new, just stating facts. Unique can be made to work, but I haven't had great luck with big heavies and accuracy. 1680 works for ARs but truly it's loud and dirty - user friendly though. With a bolt gun you have a ton more choices than the AR guys. Develop with 105 and don't look back.

Thank you, that’s what I was looking for. I’m afraid of fast powders, being new to loading for the 300blk.
I’ve got some 105 so I’ll start there.
Thanks again

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rebel
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Re: Newb with a RARR, can, heavy subs, pistol powder.

Post by rebel » Mon Feb 12, 2018 9:25 pm

Sgtis108 wrote:
rebel wrote:
2manyToys wrote:Don't write off that N105 before you try it. It's my favorite quiet powder for heavy subs. It can also cycle an AR, in case you go down that path.

My RARR does very well with with N105 and 190-220gn bullets. You may want to read through the stickies, especially the one for single shot pet loads.
This^^^^^^
105 is a great powder that will provide you with decent case fill. Titegroup and the like - yeah, you can shoot it but ES is rough and being new to the round, you can get get to over pressure in a heartbeat. Hell, you can do it even if you are an expert. One can get into trouble quick with the uber fast powders. They are very quiet, and will blow a primer in a zinute. As I said, case fill with these isn't great with a lot of powder laying horizontal in the case. Not picking on you because your new, just stating facts. Unique can be made to work, but I haven't had great luck with big heavies and accuracy. 1680 works for ARs but truly it's loud and dirty - user friendly though. With a bolt gun you have a ton more choices than the AR guys. Develop with 105 and don't look back.

Thank you, that’s what I was looking for. I’m afraid of fast powders, being new to loading for the 300blk.

I’ve got some 105 so I’ll start there.
Thanks again
Check dellet and certifables posts using N105. Cert has used it in many loads and it seems to have always performed well.
You can't beat the mountain, pilgrim. Mountains got its own way.

riude
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Re: Newb with a RARR, can, heavy subs, pistol powder.

Post by riude » Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:31 am

Again, just my opinions:
Case filling ain´t problem in 300blk with any powder.
If someone refers to "Reduced-Charge Detonation" or such, please show me some real report of this myth?
As far as I can know, any powder manufacturer or proof/reaserch instance hasn´t ever be able to produce such thing in laboratory? I bet they have user quite a lot of resources to do it.
I might be wrong, but won´t believe it before some real evidence.

Here in Finland many many people have shot subs for decades on almost every caliber with N310 powder.
Example I have shot 270 win subs with it, without any problems. Without any buffer material.
I can tell you filling degree is quite low.
For accuracy, keyword is fast enough pistolpowder to get constant chamber pressure and slippery (cast, or even better plated cast bullets).
Jacketed bullets are definite no-go´s for accuracy. By accuracy I mean max. moa with 10 rds/100 meters.
Personally, I don´t see any reason why experienced reloader shouldn´t develop his own subsonic loads with any pistol powder.

But as said, just my opinions, do your own research and stay safe.

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rebel
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Re: Newb with a RARR, can, heavy subs, pistol powder.

Post by rebel » Tue Feb 13, 2018 7:28 am

I agree - key word experienced. Fast powders are among the most quiet. I wasn't referring to secondary explosion effect, I was referring that a iot of low fill, fast powders gave some fairly big ES numbers.
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dellet
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Re: Newb with a RARR, can, heavy subs, pistol powder.

Post by dellet » Tue Feb 13, 2018 12:06 pm

riude wrote:Again, just my opinions:
Case filling ain´t problem in 300blk with any powder.
If someone refers to "Reduced-Charge Detonation" or such, please show me some real report of this myth?
As far as I can know, any powder manufacturer or proof/reaserch instance hasn´t ever be able to produce such thing in laboratory? I bet they have user quite a lot of resources to do it.
I might be wrong, but won´t believe it before some real evidence.

Here in Finland many many people have shot subs for decades on almost every caliber with N310 powder.
Example I have shot 270 win subs with it, without any problems. Without any buffer material.
I can tell you filling degree is quite low.
For accuracy, keyword is fast enough pistolpowder to get constant chamber pressure and slippery (cast, or even better plated cast bullets).
Jacketed bullets are definite no-go´s for accuracy. By accuracy I mean max. moa with 10 rds/100 meters.
Personally, I don´t see any reason why experienced reloader shouldn´t develop his own subsonic loads with any pistol powder.

But as said, just my opinions, do your own research and stay safe.
The powder that bothers me in reduced loads is H110/296. A lot of debate over the years, but here is the warning that used to be on all Hodgden/Winchester load data for the powder.
For those loads listed where a starting load is not shown, start 10% below the suggested maximum load and then approach maximums carefully, watching for any sign of pressure (difficult extraction, cratered and flattened or blown primers, and unusual recoil). H110 and Winchester 296 loads should not be reduced more than 3%.

Reduce H110 and Winchester 296 loads 3% and work up from there. H110 and Winchester 296 if reduced too much will cause inconsistent ignition. In some cases it will lodge a bullet in the barrel, causing a hazardous situation (Barrel Obstruction). This may cause severe personal injury or death to users or bystanders. DO NOT REDUCE H110 LOADS BY MORE THAN 3%.
A lot of revolvers damaged or destroyed with reduced loads using those powders. Correct that it has not been proven in labs, but why chance it with that particular powder.

Any load that has velocity swings measured in 3 digits is not safe, and I have personally seen that with a few fast powders loaded in low densities, and often with H110/296.

In most bolt actions, they are strong enough to hold together. Revolvers, some lever guns and AR's the actions just aren't strong enough to play those games.

Same goes when using smokeless and down loading for black powder cartridges. There are a few powders that are banned in competition for the same reason.
300 Blackout, not just for sub-sonics.

riude
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Re: Newb with a RARR, can, heavy subs, pistol powder.

Post by riude » Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:37 pm

Ah, my bad :D
I didn´t think H110 as pistol powder (which it is offcourse) because it is quite much equivalent with VV N110/120 which are rifle powders.
I consider VV N300 series as pistol powders. About US powders, I´m totally newbie.
But that information about H110 was new to me, thanks. I have it, but I´ve used it to get maximum speeds, not reduced loads.

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