Max Speed To Expand

[Newbie2This]

Hello and sorry if this question has been asked before. I did a search on the forum but could not find a similar question.
I am new to this so please feel free to call me an idiot if I don't get a concept or if am wrong way outside the ballpark, am here to learn what I don't know so I don't mind.

If I shoot a bullet within a 20 yard range, is there a speed where a hollow point or soft tip bullet is leaving the muzzle at such a high speed that it will go right through something before it can expand?
Or will the bullet expand at any speed that is above it's recommended minimum velocity???

Like I said IF this has been hashed before am sorry but please point me in the right direction on how to find this out.

Thanks in advance
Newbie

[dellet]

Hello and sorry if this question has been asked before. I did a search on the forum but could not find a similar question.
I am new to this so please feel free to call me an idiot if I don't get a concept or if am wrong way outside the ballpark, am here to learn what I don't know so I don't mind.

If I shoot a bullet within a 20 yard range, is there a speed where a hollow point or soft tip bullet is leaving the muzzle at such a high speed that it will go right through something before it can expand?
Or will the bullet expand at any speed that is above it's recommended minimum velocity???

Like I said IF this has been hashed before am sorry but please point me in the right direction on how to find this out.

Thanks in advance
Newbie

I accept.
You're an idiot

Kind of a trick question, but the answer is "it depends", on a few things. How the bullet was designed, the speed and what it hits.

The Barnes Blacktip bullet is designed as an expanding bullet that is barrier blind. Passes through hard material, expands in tissue from 1350-2500 fps. Impacts in tissue above 2500 fps and it becomes more of a fracturing bullet as the petals tend to shear off. So you could shear off the petals and the body of the bullet will continue on as a cylinder.

Other bullets may lose their jacket and have the core continue.

In general an expanding bullet will expand more and faster the harder it is pushed, within the speeds it was designed for. O good example of too much speed is the Hornady 190 grain bullet designed for subsonic speeds, pushed to 1400 fps. The bullet with less expansion was shot at the higher speed. the bullet fragmented.
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In general you want to use the bullet within the velocity window it was designed for, if you want the results promised. Just remember that for every rule, there will be an exception.

If you have a certain bullet in mind, there is a good chance someone has used it and can give feedback.

Sorry about that idiot thing, but you said I could

[gds]

Like dellet said, you're an idiot.

Just kidding, but I had to.

But seriously, the question you're asking is difficult to answer because it all depends on the bullet , and its original design. As well as the velocity threshold

[wildfowler]

If I shoot a bullet within a 20 yard range, is there a speed where a hollow point or soft tip bullet is leaving the muzzle at such a high speed that it will go right through something before it can expand

No.

[Newbie2This]

Ok excellent comments and insight. I am an idiot and I don't mind saying it as long as it furthers my knowledge,, Sooooooooo,,,,,
I didn't realize that manufacturers made specifications to their bullets for max velocity or an expanding window... So I guess my next step is to go look for some bullets that are in the ballpark and look for their specifications and keep the velocity in that range,,, Thanks much for all your help.

The IDIOT,,,

[Newbie2This]

Ok so I think you all probably know where am going with this and again if it has been discussed please let me know...

Say a Sierra 220 Grain Round Nose,, (#2180),,, If I load it to go 1500 fps out of my barrel,,, expansion within 20 yards?? Is it too slow at that point???

Same bullet out of a 308 at 2300 fps???

I understand that since this is sonic I am probably better off using a smaller bullet and hitting higher velocities but am trying to understand all spectrums of the ballistics,,,
I also understand I could load a few up and buy some pork shoulders and test this but hopefully I can get a general idea...
I also understand I can call Sierra and get the specs of course,,,


Thanks much

[dellet]

If I shoot a bullet within a 20 yard range, is there a speed where a hollow point or soft tip bullet is leaving the muzzle at such a high speed that it will go right through something before it can expand

No.

Mostly because I like to argue and have a wild imagination, this is not an absolute. It is certainly more normal/correct than not.

The U.S. military had to redesign their ammo for the current deployments. The average depth of the people they are engaging is a few inches less and extremely lean. Bullets would pass through with no disruption or tumbling.

Same thing is an issue with a bullet you might use on an antelope, thin skinned and 100 pounds vs something you might use on a moose or bear. What will not through an antelope, may not reach the vitals of a moose. Something that will penetrate 6-8" of moose before expanding, may pass completely through an antelope. Matching bullet and game is important.

And for the new guy, welcome to the fun.

[Newbie2This]

Hello Dellet and thank you for the reply,,, Yes that is something I have in mind but am first trying to figure out if there are general rules to follow here before testing,,, I have emailed Sierra to ask about a specific bullet. I hope to eventually settle on something I can rely on even if shooting it on the slower side... I am NOT looking at long range,, nothing even past 100 yards,,, if it's that far out I can walk away type of scenario,,, I hope that makes sense,,,

Thanks in advance,,,

[dellet]

It seems the more rules there are, the more exceptions there are.

In general bullets designed for most 308 caliber cartridges expand around 1800 fps. The exception to that are bullets designed for the 30-30 around 1600 fps and Blackout 1400 fps.

Some thin jacketed match bullets can come apart at lower velocities because of the higher spin rate or might reliably tumble.

That round nose may expand at 1500, but not as far as designed. That's where you just have to try and see.

Guys like Wildfowler have shot more animals, with more bullets at more speeds, than I have so tap into that kind of experience. I have tested a lot of bullets for the cartridge, but always yield to those that can post pics of multiple dead animals.

[rebel]

I think the new guy is either questioning CQB/Home defense scenarios or he may be a serial killer IDK
Having shot and killed a lot of stuff, big and small, medium skinned to thin skinned I think hunting bullets such as the vmax or vArmageddon would be preferred options. The 125 sst would work as well though a bit heavy for room to room and may over penetrate. The 125 Nosler has a bit tougher jacket and will definitely over penetrate. For what I THINK you are describing end use, you want the fastest, most explosive bullet to be had. Have fun, be safe.