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Home Defense Sub-Sonic Ammo

Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:38 pm
by LeoC4
I added a 300BLK AR pistol to my arsenal, primarily as my home defense firearm. The bedside 1911 (8 rnds) wouldn't cut it in a home invasion event. 30 rounds with a mounted light/laser on the AR pistol and the ability to grab an extra 30 rnd magazine makes more sense. I plan to add a suppressor in the future for use with sub-sonic ammo.

As I am focused on interior only home defense use (range of 50 feet or less), I'm looking for self-defense sub-sonic ammo. While there is plenty of range style sub-sonic ammo, there only appears to be one manufacture which has a legitimate self-defense round: Hornady 190g Sub-X.

Who else offers a legitimate sub-sonic self-defense round? Included in what I consider "range" ammo is HPBT which doesn't (to my knowledge) provide the necessary expansion in a subsonic round.

Re: Home Defense Sub-Sonic Ammo

Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2019 9:48 pm
by rebel
None really. Unless you are planning on shooting through your house. Subs overpenetrate big time, even expanding ones.
Think light and fast, 110 vmax or the like. Still does ( more than enough ) job on bad guys and won't kill your next door neighbor. Fast expanding , high velocity bullets will stop fairly quick.

Re: Home Defense Sub-Sonic Ammo

Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:11 pm
by GunFunZS
LeHi or however it is spelled had a couple impressive performers. They may look like a gimmick company, but they have a long track record of only making claims they can back up.

https://www.lehighdefense.com/products/ ... 1066138648

Re: Home Defense Sub-Sonic Ammo

Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2019 11:40 pm
by Sharkbite
When i got my 9” AAC SBR and a can (762sdn6), my initial thought was similar to the OP’s.

Subsonic and suppressed....a longgun i could shoot without blowing my eardrums!!!!

After playing with subs in different loadings (Lehigh included), i just could not find a load that did what i wanted (good performance on badguys, limited over-penetration in building materials).

My house rifle is that same SBR, now with a Gemtech 300blk can, loaded with Hornady 110gn V-max. Supersonic loads are still a little loud thru the can, but not ear splitting. Certainly quieter to my ear then an unsuppressed handgun, and i get rifle power.

Re: Home Defense Sub-Sonic Ammo

Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 9:55 am
by LeoC4
rebel wrote:...Subs overpenetrate big time, even expanding ones....
I've heard that sub-sonic ammo over-penetrates before, but with 500ft-lbs or less of energy, they wouldn't be much different from .45 ACP rounds. Where's the evidence to support the claim that sub-sonic ammo over-penetrates?

Re: Home Defense Sub-Sonic Ammo

Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 10:17 am
by rebel
From me shooting a lot of it testing bullets. Your expanding subs like Maker and LeHigh stop quicker in gel (i.e. muscle and guts) but would still have a good chance of complete pass through on an average size man. Don't even get me started on A-Maxes and Match Kings, Ive had complete pass through on 16" of wetpack and a 2x6.
Most don't get complete through and through sub-hunting deer with the expanders, but generally achieve deep penetration with these in a hunting situation if heavy bone is avoided.
edit-viewtopic.php?f=145&t=102575&sid=e9f854 ... 4a81d0378d
There are several sub kills in this thread, check out the performance of these different projectiles.

Re: Home Defense Sub-Sonic Ammo

Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 10:39 am
by dellet
LeoC4 wrote:
rebel wrote:...Subs overpenetrate big time, even expanding ones....
I've heard that sub-sonic ammo over-penetrates before, but with 500ft-lbs or less of energy, they wouldn't be much different from .45 ACP rounds. Where's the evidence to support the claim that sub-sonic ammo over-penetrates?
Every time an arrow from a recurve passes through an elk. :mrgreen:

Projectile design will make or break this argument.

Re: Home Defense Sub-Sonic Ammo

Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 4:28 pm
by rebel
dellet wrote:
LeoC4 wrote:
rebel wrote:...Subs overpenetrate big time, even expanding ones....
I've heard that sub-sonic ammo over-penetrates before, but with 500ft-lbs or less of energy, they wouldn't be much different from .45 ACP rounds. Where's the evidence to support the claim that sub-sonic ammo over-penetrates?
Every time an arrow from a recurve passes through an elk. :mrgreen:

Projectile design will make or break this argument.
I would think the Makers with their tougher petals or maybe the fracturing variety wouldn't be as bad. I have threatened to build sheet rock walls, like 2' by 4' just to see. Another project I haven't the time for.

Re: Home Defense Sub-Sonic Ammo

Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 6:09 pm
by LeoC4
rebel wrote:...Makers with their tougher petals or maybe the fracturing variety
Thanks. I didn't know of them as a source. They don't provide recommended loading info on their website...something to track down.

If there's a violent home invasion, over-penetration (through interior walls, wood-core doors) isn't such a bad thing. There's only 2 of us in the home and no neighbors within 100 yards.

Re: Home Defense Sub-Sonic Ammo

Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2019 6:48 pm
by GunFunZS
LeoC4 wrote:
rebel wrote:...Subs overpenetrate big time, even expanding ones....
I've heard that sub-sonic ammo over-penetrates before, but with 500ft-lbs or less of energy, they wouldn't be much different from .45 ACP rounds. Where's the evidence to support the claim that sub-sonic ammo over-penetrates?
A few seconds of google will find you plenty of evidence. Also a dumb guy on TFB named Andrew, who can't let his own results interrupt his biases.

SMK 220
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i1Q7xRmZAtk

NOE 247 cast
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ag-dtVjHz4

full playlist
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=adaEF5N ... H7JNXF77J2

These are far from the only good tests out there, and there are plenty of shoddy tests which don't tell you much.